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Non-standard Medicine Entry

Mana

there are no stupid questions, only people
Administrator
Depending on the type and recency of criminal conviction, it may be very difficult to obtain a Working with Vulnerable People Card, which is a requirement for studying medicine.

Pharmacy is likely to have similar restrictions, I'm sure. The poster in question doesn't seem to have mentioned medicine though.
 

Yamster

Dental Moderator
Emeritus Staff
Hey Jamesstarry91,

Is there a particular reason that you're aiming for a 6.5 GPA? In general terms, that's an excellent GPA but for post-grad med applications I believe that it's actually an average score (maybe even a below average score) - not my expertise, I'd have to call in Crow or Perplex to comment.

A GPA of 6.5 isn't needed to get into pharmacy. A GPA of 4 is all that is needed, and with 17 pharmacy schools across Australia, the market seems a bit saturated at the moment (consider the fact that cohort sizes are up to 200-300 for some universities as well).

It is true that pharmacists help people but retail pharmacy is as its names suggests, more retail than clinical. Clinical positions in hospitals are few and internships even fewer. If you look at industry reports, it shows that pharmacy has one of the highest full time-grad prospects but they're also one of the lowest paid-grads. I'd recommend that you look into the current pay situation which has averaged at about $32 an hour (and doesn't seem to be going up): Pharmacist award pay increased . Sure, money isn't the end goal but being paid the same as a late night shelf stocker or a bottle shop worker for a 4 year degree doesn't sound that flash (although, on the bright side it might still be better than the unemployment rates from BSc/BBiomedSc). Have a look at this 32 page thread on Whirlpool about pharmacy: https://forums.whirlpool.net.au/forum-replies.cfm?t=2663201 and decide if it's for you.

I believe that criminal convictions have to be declared to AHPRA as well as per LMGs and Manas post above. If I were you, I'd look into this a bit more as most health/allied health professionals (including: chiropractors, dentists, medical practioners, nurses/midwives, optometrists, osteopaths, pharmacists, physiotherapists, podiatrists and psychologists) have to be registered with AHPRA in order to practice (legally at least).

These thoughts are just my 2c though, you might love the profession!
 
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Perplex

Emeritus Staff
Emeritus Staff
I would read thoroughly into the current job market for pharmacy before signing yourself up. I don't know the intricacies but it's something to investigate for yourself.
As Mana has mentioned, it's difficult to discuss whether a 6.5 is "difficult" to achieve. This is dependent on a plethora of factors and anything I say is purely speculative. However, no health degree is easy, they all require substantial effort and attaining high scores is often not easy.
 

DrDrLMG!

Resident Medical Officer
Administrator
Pharmacy is likely to have similar restrictions, I'm sure. The poster in question doesn't seem to have mentioned medicine though.

Pharmacy doesn’t require a WWVP card. I confirmed this last night with a pharmacist. I clearly didn’t read the OP’s post properly, whoops.

ETA: to clarify, if the OP is currently enrolled in BPharm(Hons) and is hoping to maintain a 6.5GPA for postgrad Med then my advice stands :)
 

canUhearMe?

Member
How hard do you think it will be to achieve and maintain a GPA 6.5 in a bachelor of pharmacy with honours.
Kind regards

If you are going to pursue honours I would be cautious and highly vigilant. Ensure that you're project is feasible, whilst Honours class 1 (H1) can be achieved even with an unsuccessful study, you will have to be exceptional in terms of your delivery of findings. Certain Uni's and GPA calculation methods align H1 =7, H2a = 6 ect. I consider it to be quite risky. Perhaps further course work may be of lower risk in the face of uncertain research, especially if you are new to the realm of scientific research.
 

Aus2018

Member
Overall UMAT Score:180
Section One:67
UAC rank assessed: 99.95
Preferred University:
Uni Adelaide/ UNSW/Monash/JMP
Course Type:
Medicine
Application type: School leaver with overseas Y12 result (not IB)
State: NSW
Rural:
no
Indigenous Applicant: no
GWS: no
Other Bonuses: no
Just graduated from overseas high school in June 2018 and have UAC QAS assessed result as 99.95. Is this result equivalent to the ATAR?
UAC advised that as my result is not AUS Y12, I will not be competing with the Y12 pool but in another pool. Do you have any info on this ?
Does this apply to other States?
Do other States have QAS service?
I have already applied to the above Uni and what are my chances?
 

A1

Rookie Doc
Moderator
Just graduated from overseas high school in June 2018 and have UAC QAS assessed result as 99.95. Is this result equivalent to the ATAR?
UAC advised that as my result is not AUS Y12, I will not be competing with the Y12 pool but in another pool. Do you have any info on this ?

Afaik apart from rural/EAS Unsw/JMP have one pool for combined Y12s & non-standards (=uni students). This advice seems odd as what other pool can they put you in?

Unsw mentions just two groups: Y12s with Aus ATAR/OP/IB (or equivalent), or uni students. You are not uni student so it's likely you will be considered as Y12 with an equiv ATAR. For Monash & Adelaide VTAC/SATAC will work out the equiv ATAR for you but you need to keep an eye on them. Last year one student was given 99+ in two states yet only 93 in another and had to appeal to get it corrected.

You should get interviews at these 4 unis with about 50/50 chances at Unsw/Monash, 25% at JMP/Adelaide.
 

Aus2018

Member
Afaik apart from rural/EAS Unsw/JMP have one pool for combined Y12s & non-standards (=uni students). This advice seems odd as what other pool can they put you in?

Unsw mentions just two groups: Y12s with Aus ATAR/OP/IB (or equivalent), or uni students. You are not uni student so it's likely you will be considered as Y12 with an equiv ATAR. For Monash & Adelaide VTAC/SATAC will work out the equiv ATAR for you but you need to keep an eye on them. Last year one student was given 99+ in two states yet only 93 in another and had to appeal to get it corrected.

You should get interviews at these 4 unis with about 50/50 chances at Unsw/Monash, 25% at JMP/Adelaide.
Many thanks for the advice.
Do you think I will get an interview with USyd for DDMP?
 

DrDrLMG!

Resident Medical Officer
Administrator
Many thanks for the advice.
Do you think I will get an interview with USyd for DDMP?

Assuming your 99.95 is what UAC use (and it seems they will given they the ones who’ve told you this), then yes, I would think so.
 

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Alphie

Lurker
Hey guys,

I am a current year 12 student in Sydney, and was looking to get into undergrad medicine by 2020. I was just wondering if I do a science degree and the UMAT, will my ATAR from the previous year still be taken into account by the universities, or is it strictly just the current year of university studies with the UMAT.

And by any chance, does anyone know how hard it is to get into med, after 1 year of studying at uni?

Thanks
 

DrDrLMG!

Resident Medical Officer
Administrator
Hey guys,

I am a current year 12 student in Sydney, and was looking to get into undergrad medicine by 2020. I was just wondering if I do a science degree and the UMAT, will my ATAR from the previous year still be taken into account by the universities, or is it strictly just the current year of university studies with the UMAT.

And by any chance, does anyone know how hard it is to get into med, after 1 year of studying at uni?

Thanks

There are many well researched threads here at MSO that will readily answer these questions. I suggest you have a bit of a look around.

I'd start here
[Undergrad] - (2018 Updated) Med schools Selection Criteria Y12s & Non-standards
Common pitfalls to avoid for year 12 school leavers and other medicine applicants
 
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thrway7

Lurker
Hi, I'm currently a first year undergraduate doing a double degree course. In my UAC application when they asked for my tertiary qualifications, they also asked "how long have you studied for" and I stupidly put "6 months" because that was how long I had studied at the time of application. They've made it so I can't change that now, so should I make a new "qualification" with "1 year" ??

Also, JMP states that tertiary transfers "must have completed a minimum of one full-time year (EFTSL = 1), or equivalent part time, in a single program of approved study at a higher education institution. Study undertaken across two or more programs cannot be combined to satisfy the one full-time year of study requirement."

Does that mean that 1 year of doing courses for both my degrees doesn't count for JMP? And i'll be considered as having a gap year?

Thanks heaps
 

Woo18

Member
hey! what undergraduate courses do you recommend to do to get into med after high school?
By reading various sub forums on here, anything you are interested in. It is not worth studying a something that if you never make it into medicine you don't enjoy. My son for example is deciding between Pharmacy and Optometry
 

mick

Member
Hey guys, graduated a few years ago and my GPA was 4.87, just wondering if it would even be worth applying vs just doing another undegrad?

If another undergraduate, which bachelor would you suggest, I'm in Melbourne so any of those uni's would be fine.

Thanks everyone.
 

DrDrLMG!

Resident Medical Officer
Administrator
Hey guys, graduated a few years ago and my GPA was 4.87, just wondering if it would even be worth applying vs just doing another undegrad?

If another undergraduate, which bachelor would you suggest, I'm in Melbourne so any of those uni's would be fine.

Thanks everyone.

Your current GPA may be eligible for JMP (in NSW) who require a “close to credit average”, but that’s about it.

I also believe some grad entry Med unis use the GPA from your first bachelor degree regardless of whether you’ve done additional study, so starting a new degree might not help. Crow can probably advise you further.
 

Crow

Staff | Junior Doctor
Moderator
Your current GPA may be eligible for JMP (in NSW) who require a “close to credit average”, but that’s about it.

I also believe some grad entry Med unis use the GPA from your first bachelor degree regardless of whether you’ve done additional study, so starting a new degree might not help. Crow can probably advise you further.
Yep mick, the JMP is probably your only option currently. Graduate entry schools via GEMSAS won’t consider your results from any other degree until it is completed (or it will be completed in the year you apply). This also applies for Flinders. I’d agree your best bet is to start a new degree (one that will allow you to follow an alternative career path) and apply via the graduate entry pathway, as well as sitting UCAT and applying for JMP, WSU and potentially UNSW (depending on your ATAR) and JCU (depending on your written application + rurality) as a non-standard applicant each year along the way. Good luck :)
 

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mick

Member
LMG!
Crow
This has been super helpful thanks so much!

Any advice on which degrees to look at? I'm assuming any is fine so long as I can pick up anatomy/physiology/biochemistry in second year?
 

DrDrLMG!

Resident Medical Officer
Administrator
LMG!
Crow
This has been super helpful thanks so much!

Any advice on which degrees to look at? I'm assuming any is fine so long as I can pick up anatomy/physiology/biochemistry in second year?

Most grad med unis don’t have pre-reqs, but given you’ve mentioned your interest in Melbourne unis specifically, then yeah, to open up UoM make sure you tick off theirs.

To be honest, you can do just about anything. My main advice is to choose something you’re interested in (preferably a career degree like paramedic or physio or nursing or similar in a non-health field where you can do some breadth subjects to tick off the pre-reqs) regardless, rather than just something you’d do to get into Med because, purely based on statistics, you’re more likely to not get into Med than you are to get in. You don’t want to be stuck with another degree that isn’t what you want to do (assuming this is the case with your first bachelor).

In might also be worth looking into the Monash program where a certain number of their own students are selected into Med each year. I’m not sure if this is open to non-school leavers/people not in their first degree, but if it is, doing this new bachelor at Monash might re-open that door for you, too (which would otherwise be very closed).

ETA: https://www.monash.edu/study/course...ical-science-and-medicine-m6011?domestic=true

It looks like the options are Science, Biomedical Science (probably don’t do these!), Pharmacy, or Physiotherapy (much better choices) to open up the Monash grad pathway.
 
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Crow

Staff | Junior Doctor
Moderator
In might also be worth looking into the Monash program where a certain number of their own students are selected into Med each year. I’m not sure if this is open to non-school leavers/people not in their first degree, but if it is, doing this new bachelor at Monash might re-open that door for you, too (which would otherwise be very closed).
I’m about 90% sure this is only for Biomed (NOT recommended) or Physio students at Monash, so unless mick is keen to follow the Physio path (a great career in its own right, by the way) this might not help them, unfortunately. (Happy to be corrected here though - I’ve never looked too closely at Monash as it’s never been an option for me).
 

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