Non-standard Medicine Entry

[DDS]

Thanks Crow, that was very helpful

 

[robbie014]

Hey all,

Sadly my UMAT and ATAR scores are not good enough for me to get into any undergrad programs, but i'm still keen to study medicine in the long run. I'm almost definitely going to study in Melbourne next year, and it seems studying Biomedicine/Biomedical Science at UniMelb or Monash is the obvious pathway into a graduate Medicine program. Seeing as the undergraduate degrees are mostly similar, I'm wondering if anyone has any information about which graduate program is easier to get into at each university, of course including things like the GAMSAT, Interviews, etc. This is probably a tough question to answer since you would only have experience in one of these universities, but any advice would help!

 

[DrDrLMG!]

it seems studying Biomedicine/Biomedical Science at UniMelb or Monash is the obvious pathway into a graduate Medicine program.

I'm not sure where you've received this information, but it's not the case. Doing a specific degree for the sake of getting into graduate medicine only (ie. not doing the degree also because it is a viable backup career on its own) is not advised at all. Statistically, most people do not get into medicine, and it is therefore very important to keep this in mind when considering your university degree choices. If your backup to Medicine would be to be a medical researcher, and you were also prepared to have to do honours and a PhD and then live research contract to research contract (which it may well be), then choosing biomedicine/biomedical science would be an okay interim pathway (but so would many, many others), but if you have no desire to work in medical research or similar, then this is not a wise choice at all.

The Monash graduate entry program also includes Physio and Pharmacy, both of which are viable backup career degrees. You may not be interested in either of these, but it's very important to realise that your options are NOT, in any way, shape, or form, limited to biomedicine/biomedical science.

UMelb graduate entry medicine requires a couple of pre-requisites that you can cover off from many degrees, so again, you are not locked into biomedicine/biomedical science.

I'd recommend having a bit of a read through this thread (and similar ones) and also Common pitfalls to avoid for year 12 school leavers and other medicine applicants.

If you have any other questions, please feel free to ask. There are a few of us here that are quite passionate about this topic and the notion that students get stuck thinking biomedicine/medical research/health science are the only viable pathways to graduate entry medicine and we are more than happy to chat through things with you further if you're not sure about anything.

Obviously you should also discuss with other relevant people in your life (guidance counsellors, parents, etc), we just bring a slightly different perspective.

 

[Crow]

There are a few of us here that are quite passionate about this topic and the notion that students get stuck thinking biomedicine/medical research/health science are the only viable pathways to graduate entry medicine and we are more than happy to chat through things with you further if you're not sure about anything.

100%. robbie014 I was in your position when I first finished school, but I unfortunately wasn’t on MSO at the time, and I absolutely wish I was. I fully echo @LMG!’s sentiments above - there are so many more options out there other than biomed/health science, and you aren’t going to disadvantage yourself at all (in terms of graduate entry medicine) by pursuing another degree. Here to answer any questions you have! (FYI: I’m a Biomed graduate who will be starting graduate entry medicine in January).

 

[mthk]

Hi, I got my atar today and I was really really disappointed
I got an 81 ATAR which is far off from studying dentistry or medicine
Ares there any courses you guys recommend (at a Qld university) that is good to transfer with?
I considered pharmacy but apparently, the content's really heavy and it's hard to achieve high marks in
My interests are maths and science so please help me out
Thank you!

 

[robbie014]

Thanks both Crow and LMG! for your fantastic responses. I have heard of the idea of doing a bachelor's degree in a different field before medicine, but I guess i drifted away from it because I thought the science background from biomed would help with the GAMSAT, as well as the prospect of attaining one of the reserved places these degrees have for the graduate medicine programs (I think Monash has 50 MD places reserved for biomed students). However in saying this, I read the science knowledge needed for the GAMSAT is not exhaustive in any way, mostly covering 1st year content. Should I be worried about either of these factors? And say I was to do a non-science degree, how would I cover the GAMSAT content needed?

 

[DrDrLMG!]

Thanks both Crow and LMG! for your fantastic responses. I have heard of the idea of doing a bachelor's degree in a different field before medicine, but I guess i drifted away from it because I thought the science background from biomed would help with the GAMSAT, as well as the prospect of attaining one of the reserved places these degrees have for the graduate medicine programs (I think Monash has 50 MD places reserved for biomed students). However in saying this, I read the science knowledge needed for the GAMSAT is not exhaustive in any way, mostly covering 1st year content. Should I be worried about either of these factors? And say I was to do a non-science degree, how would I cover the GAMSAT content needed?

As I mentioned, Monash also have MD places reserved for BPharm and BPhysio (and BSci) students. And yes, I've not sat GAMSAT myself, but I have certainly read that there has been a significant move away from science knowledge and more towards reasoning. As far as I'm aware, UMelb do not have any reserved places beyond the Chancellor's program (someone correct me if I'm wrong).

You don't necessarily need to move away from a science-based degree altogether. There are many that would allow you to cover the content required for UMelb's pre-requisites (a more important consideration than a degree that would cover GAMSAT content). The key question to ask yourself is, if I never get into medicine what would I like to do instead as a career? If it's not a question you've asked yourself yet, then I think that's the best place to start.

But to get you off and running you might consider things like: pharmacy, physiotherapy, nursing, engineering, occupational therapy, speech pathology, radiography, psychology, etc. And if your answer to the question I posed above is actually, teaching, law, accountancy, social work, then those are all perfectly acceptable gateways to graduate entry medicine, too.

ETA: if you did lean towards a non-science degree, then, in my experience, you can do one unit per semester in a 'breadth' area (including from other faculties), this would allow you to complete any pre-requisites required and is definitely worth looking into.

 

[Kezia]

Hi Everyone!

I’m currently halfway through my first year of nursing (after switching from one sem of biomed). I am absolutely loving nursing and thought that it’d be best for me to take a ‘gap year’ after graduating nursing and spend the year working as a graduate RN instead of going straight into medicine. Now, that means that I can take GAMSAT next year, 2021 and possibly 2022 while I’m working as a nurse. I’m also considering taking UCAT but have found out that unis don’t allow deferring for Med offers. Would I be better off focusing on grad-med entry instead of trying for non-standard every year during my undergrad?

 

[Mana]

Hi Everyone!

I’m currently halfway through my first year of nursing (after switching from one sem of biomed). I am absolutely loving nursing and thought that it’d be best for me to take a ‘gap year’ after graduating nursing and spend the year working as a graduate RN instead of going straight into medicine. Now, that means that I can take GAMSAT next year, 2021 and possibly 2022 while I’m working as a nurse. I’m also considering taking UCAT but have found out that unis don’t allow deferring for Med offers. Would I be better off focusing on grad-med entry instead of trying for non-standard every year during my undergrad?

Given that the UCAT is a 2(?) hour exam, I would certainly be taking the UCAT every year for as long as it is feasible for you (at the very least each year that you are studying). It's also held at a different time to the GAMSAT.

If you are serious about medicine, I'd be taking the UMAT and GAMSAT at every possible opportunity while you were studying. It's one day out of a year per test (two if you sit GAMSAT twice in a year).

Given that the vast majority of applicants will not get in via either stream, you will be wanting to maximise your chances as much as possible, and that means applying through all the pathways available to you at each stage.

 

[DrDrLMG!]

Also, Kezia all non-standard Unis have a deferment policy for medicine. It varies slightly, for some you need to apply in writing, for others, you can just select to defer. I’ve not looked into the GAMSAT Unis, so it might be different for those.

 

[Crow]

Deferring a graduate entry offer is pretty much a no go - it’s only allowed in extreme circumstances that are outside of your control that you couldn’t have foreseen when you applied.

 

[submarine]

Hi Everyone!

I’m currently halfway through my first year of nursing (after switching from one sem of biomed). I am absolutely loving nursing and thought that it’d be best for me to take a ‘gap year’ after graduating nursing and spend the year working as a graduate RN instead of going straight into medicine. Now, that means that I can take GAMSAT next year, 2021 and possibly 2022 while I’m working as a nurse. I’m also considering taking UCAT but have found out that unis don’t allow deferring for Med offers. Would I be better off focusing on grad-med entry instead of trying for non-standard every year during my undergrad?

Hi Kezia

I am personally a nurse as well who just finished my Nursing degree in 2016 so very happy to see someone like you who are on your way to med school like my pathway. After graduating I got offered graduate RN at my hospital and worked nearly 2 years but in between I applied to JCU Dental school only as I didn't get chance to prepare/study for GAMSAT/UMAT hence my only option left was JCU as it doesn't require any entrance test other than application form and GPA.
If you don't mind which school or location (Townsville if you want to study JCU med), then probably consider JCU as it does allow you to defer. I applied in 2017 and got accepted into dental course but had to defer due to my contract with my hospital and JCU did allow me to defer my commencement until this year. As Mana pointed out neither GAMSAT/UMAT/(UCAT) are easy at all as I did attend GAMSAT once in March 2016 but the score wasn't good enough. However if you do well in those tests it definitely opens up more window of choices.
Anyway good choice on nursing as it offers job opportunities through casual/agencies even while studying dental/medical school so financial wise wouldn't be too hard.

 

[Kezia]

Hi Kezia

I am personally a nurse as well who just finished my Nursing degree in 2016 so very happy to see someone like you who are on your way to med school like my pathway. After graduating I got offered graduate RN at my hospital and worked nearly 2 years but in between I applied to JCU Dental school only as I didn't get chance to prepare/study for GAMSAT/UMAT hence my only option left was JCU as it doesn't require any entrance test other than application form and GPA.
If you don't mind which school or location (Townsville if you want to study JCU med), then probably consider JCU as it does allow you to defer. I applied in 2017 and got accepted into dental course but had to defer due to my contract with my hospital and JCU did allow me to defer my commencement until this year. As Mana pointed out neither GAMSAT/UMAT/(UCAT) are easy at all as I did attend GAMSAT once in March 2016 but the score wasn't good enough. However if you do well in those tests it definitely opens up more window of choices.
Anyway good choice on nursing as it offers job opportunities through casual/agencies even while studying dental/medical school so financial wise wouldn't be too hard.

Hello Thank you so much for your insight! I actually don’t mind which uni I get into and would love to get into JCU because I’m very interested in rural medicine. I got an interview at JCU for 2018 entry but didn’t get in. I will definitely exhaust all options and see how I go. Thank you again

Given that the UCAT is a 2(?) hour exam, I would certainly be taking the UCAT every year for as long as it is feasible for you (at the very least each year that you are studying). It's also held at a different time to the GAMSAT.

If you are serious about medicine, I'd be taking the UMAT and GAMSAT at every possible opportunity while you were studying. It's one day out of a year per test (two if you sit GAMSAT twice in a year).

Given that the vast majority of applicants will not get in via either stream, you will be wanting to maximise your chances as much as possible, and that means applying through all the pathways available to you at each stage.

Hi Mana,
Thank you so much for your advice! I will definitely look into taking both. I’m just worried that I would be risking my GPA if I take both exams but if there’s a will, there’s a way!

 

[Hamza Qureshi]

Hi there,
I did my BSc (2017) and Postgraduate Diploma in Science (2018) here at Otago University.
If I want to apply in undergraduate medicine in Australia what are my choices?
I have credit average in my diploma (69%) overall. I’m after a university which doesn’t calculate GPA from my bachelors degree as they are not good enough.

Would a good high score in UMAT get me in any university by any chance.
I know of two namely UNC/UNE (joint medical program) and JCU.
Which else?

Regards

 

[DrDrLMG!]

Hi there,
I did my BSc (2017) and Postgraduate Diploma in Science (2018) here at Otago University.
If I want to apply in undergraduate medicine in Australia what are my choices?
I have credit average in my diploma (69%) overall. I’m after a university which doesn’t calculate GPA from my bachelors degree as they are not good enough.

Would a good high score in UMAT get me in any university by any chance.
I know of two namely UNC/UNE (joint medical program) and JCU.
Which else?

Regards

[Undergrad] - (2018 Updated) Med schools Selection Criteria Y12s & Non-standards

Your diploma GPA is likely too low for all with the exception of JMP, tbh.

And UMAT is no longer used. You will need to sit UCAT.

 

[Hamza Qureshi]

[Undergrad] - (2018 Updated) Med schools Selection Criteria Y12s & Non-standards

Your diploma GPA is likely too low for all with the exception of JMP, tbh.

And UMAT is no longer used. You will need to sit UCAT.

Thanks for that.
If I apply for graduate medicine what would be my options?
I know UQ considers the last tertiary degree completed.
But if I work out the weighted GPA of my last three years they add upto 5.58 as per gemsas gpa calculations.

Any suggestions?

 

[DrDrLMG!]

Thanks for that.
If I apply for graduate medicine what would be my options?
I know UQ considers the last tertiary degree completed.
But if I work out the weighted GPA of my last three years they add upto 5.58 as per gemsas gpa calculations.

Any suggestions?

Unless you are a rural applicant, I'd think your GPA is quite a bit too low for almost all graduate entry universities, perhaps with the exception of USyd, which I believe use GPA as a hurdle. The portfolio universities may also be an option. I'd recommend you check out the GEMSAS guide and the USyd website for more information.

If you have further graduate entry med questions, please ask them in the appropriate thread: [Grad] - Graduate Medicine FAQ and Quick Questions

 

[Crow]

Thanks for that.
If I apply for graduate medicine what would be my options?
I know UQ considers the last tertiary degree completed.
But if I work out the weighted GPA of my last three years they add upto 5.58 as per gemsas gpa calculations.

Any suggestions?

If you’re non-rural your only graduate entry options will be USyd and UQ (which both base interview invites solely off GAMSAT score and then place offers using a combination of GAMSAT and interview) - otherwise you’ll need to consider further study if that and JMP both don’t work out.

 

[Lyyrre]

Good morning all,

I'd like to inquire whether UNSW has a limited number of spots for non-standard applicants, or are non-standards considered in the same pool as school leaver applicants when applying? Cheers!

 

[DrDrLMG!]

Good morning all,

I'd like to inquire whether UNSW has a limited number of spots for non-standard applicants, or are non-standards considered in the same pool as school leaver applicants when applying? Cheers!

We don't believe there is a non-standard quota at UNSW, with the exception of lateral entry students into third(?) year.