Registered  members with 100+ posts do not see Ads

Quick Questions Thread #2: 2018-2019

Status
Not open for further replies.

A1

Rookie Doc
Moderator
How does UNSW offer selection work now? They’re saying that a high score for one criteria can’t compensate for a low score in another criteria (e.g. high atar can’t compensate for low UMAT). How does this work? Sorry a bit confused with it all.

Ruffle answered a similar question in this post > Quick Questions Thread #2: 2018
 

cook

Member
what kind of clothes should we wear to interviews? (I'm a girl)
if any of the unis are known to like/prefer specific clothes, pls let me knoww (like, are suits too 'formal'?)
thank you c:
 

BethMark25

WSU MBBS II
what kind of clothes should we wear to interviews? (I'm a girl)
if any of the unis are known to like/prefer specific clothes, pls let me knoww (like, are suits too 'formal'?)
thank you c:

Smart casual for most I think. Some give instructions with the interview invite.

I interviewed at WSU and JMP. I think black pants (not jeans) or a black skirt with a neat blouse or button up shirt. Or an appropriate dress. That seemed to be the attire of most people when I went. The people that wore anything more casual than that (joggers, jeans, tshirts) looked very underdressed. A few people wore suits, it looked a little too formal but I think it was better that they were overdressed than too casual.

Just dress like you would for a job interview.
 

A1

Rookie Doc
Moderator
what kind of clothes should we wear to interviews? (I'm a girl)
if any of the unis are known to like/prefer specific clothes, pls let me knoww (like, are suits too 'formal'?)
thank you c:

Adding to BethMark25 's post this was included in UWA's email sent to interviewees:
INTERVIEW ATTIRE

We work to ensure that each component of the selection process is fair to all applicants. Do not wear any uniform, accessories or badges, which identify membership of a particular organisation. This is to avoid the perception that bias has entered the selection process.

You do not need to dress too formally. Be smart, comfortable, but not too casual. The best kind of clothing for an interview will not distinguish you from the crowd. Clothing which is untidy or too revealing (such as low cut tops or short skirts or shorts) is inappropriate in this situation.

Examples of appropriate clothing would include: smart work pants and collared shirts (tie not necessary) for men and dress pants or knee-length skirt and smart top for women. It is important that you feel comfortable throughout the interview so that you can concentrate on the questions asked. Therefore ensure that you wear comfortable dress shoes and if it is cool you should bring a jacket/coat/cardigan etc. Be prepared to cope with a variety of airconditioning systems.

There's also an entire MSO thread on it > What to wear to a medical school interview?
 

Numerouno

Regular Member
Good day. Not sure if this is the appropriate forum to ask a general question. HSC 2017, gap year now. I was predicted to get ATAR 99.60 but dropped the ball in Physics by a couple of marks. But like many HSC students, I checked my score with Matrix, Atarcalc, ATAR Ninja, Talent 100 (you name it) all gave me an ATAR score of 99.50 and ATAR Ninja for the past 10 years (for my school) gave an Overall 99.5+/-0.15 for my HSC scores.

Alas, I got 99.20 only at the end and it ousted my chances at UNSW interviews. It was a shocker and I could not find a reason why this happened. Was it the cohort in 2017? Has anyone experienced this variance as I am still trying to digest the dismal show from what I had set as my goal? I checked my actual scores soon after the HSC results and checked what these sites predicted an ATAR for those actual scores. There is no use doing a post-mortem now but thought I could ask for advise and find out the reason for such variance when 10-year statistics gave me a much higher ATAR.
 

Ruffle

Puffle
Emeritus Staff
Good day. Not sure if this is the appropriate forum to ask a general question. HSC 2017, gap year now. I was predicted to get ATAR 99.60 but dropped the ball in Physics by a couple of marks. But like many HSC students, I checked my score with Matrix, Atarcalc, ATAR Ninja, Talent 100 (you name it) all gave me an ATAR score of 99.50 and ATAR Ninja for the past 10 years (for my school) gave an Overall 99.5+/-0.15 for my HSC scores.

Alas, I got 99.20 only at the end and it ousted my chances at UNSW interviews. It was a shocker and I could not find a reason why this happened. Was it the cohort in 2017? Has anyone experienced this variance as I am still trying to digest the dismal show from what I had set as my goal? I checked my actual scores soon after the HSC results and checked what these sites predicted an ATAR for those actual scores. There is no use doing a post-mortem now but thought I could ask for advise and find out the reason for such variance when 10-year statistics gave me a much higher ATAR.
Hey, sorry to hear that. The ATAR predictors can be very inaccurate (mine was over 1 ATAR percentile off). This discrepancy can arise from several things, like the difficulty of the exam on the day, the cohort, etc.- even though they might scale HSC scores to account for these factors, it's not going to make everything match up exactly with the historical data. (Especially if you're taking subjects with a small cohort.)
99.20 is still a great atar if that's any reassurance. Hope that helps :)

(edited: spelling/grammar)
 
Last edited:

Numerouno

Regular Member
Hey, sorry to hear that. The ATAR predictors can be very inaccurate (mine was over 1 ATAR percentile off). This discrepancy can arise from several things, like the difficulty of the exam on the day, the cohort, etc.- even though they might scale HSC scores to account for these factors, it's not going to make everything match up exactly with the historical data. Especialy if you're taking subjects with a small cohort.
99.20 is still a great atar if that's any reassurance. Hope that helps :)

Thanks a lot. With a better UMAT score this year, I am in the game again. :yes:
 

Woo18

Member
Good day. Not sure if this is the appropriate forum to ask a general question. HSC 2017, gap year now. I was predicted to get ATAR 99.60 but dropped the ball in Physics by a couple of marks. But like many HSC students, I checked my score with Matrix, Atarcalc, ATAR Ninja, Talent 100 (you name it) all gave me an ATAR score of 99.50 and ATAR Ninja for the past 10 years (for my school) gave an Overall 99.5+/-0.15 for my HSC scores.

Alas, I got 99.20 only at the end and it ousted my chances at UNSW interviews. It was a shocker and I could not find a reason why this happened. Was it the cohort in 2017? Has anyone experienced this variance as I am still trying to digest the dismal show from what I had set as my goal? I checked my actual scores soon after the HSC results and checked what these sites predicted an ATAR for those actual scores. There is no use doing a post-mortem now but thought I could ask for advise and find out the reason for such variance when 10-year statistics gave me a much higher ATAR.
I fully understand your frustration with this. In QLD the kids sit the QCS test which changes their OP score because of certain factors. I know of a student who scored nothing lower than a VH5 in all subjects in some a VHA 8 but because of being in a small cohort who other than him performed dismally which resulted in him getting an OP 2 98.95 Atar. When the following year a student had a larger cohort that preformed better this student got atleast 1 HA as well as low to mid VHAs and they ended up with an OP 1. It is quite a flawed system.
 

A1

Rookie Doc
Moderator
Alas, I got 99.20 only at the end and it ousted my chances at UNSW interviews. It was a shocker and I could not find a reason why this happened. Was it the cohort in 2017? Has anyone experienced this variance as I am still trying to digest the dismal show from what I had set as my goal? I checked my actual scores soon after the HSC results and checked what these sites predicted an ATAR for those actual scores. There is no use doing a post-mortem now but thought I could ask for advise and find out the reason for such variance when 10-year statistics gave me a much higher ATAR.

See table A9 page 56 of this UAC report > https://www.uac.edu.au/assets/documents/scaling-reports/Scaling-Report-2017-NSW-HSC.pdf
the aggregates (of UAC scaled marks) for 99.0/99.5/99.95 have been pretty consistent over the last 5 years so it wasn't due to the 2017 cohort.

A possibility is this. For each subject your exam + your school (moderated) marks combine to an undisclosed Raw mark, then
(a) the Raw mark is aligned (to be consistent with other years) by NESA ==> your HSC mark
(b) the Raw mark is scaled by UAC ==> your scaled mark used for aggregates/ATAR

You see the different diverging between (a) and (b). I presume the calculators ask for your HSC marks, maybe in 2017 for the subjects you did (a) and (b) didn't relate to each other in the same way as has been built into the calculators.
 

Registered  members with 100+ posts do not see Ads

H_______

Member
Coming from the ACT, we have the AST, which is designed to scale our marks against the other ACT colleges. Our ATAR predictions are based on our particular school's performance in the AST in prior years. Apparently in 2017, my graduating year, we had a relatively dismal performance, which meant that some people's ATARs dropped by up to 7-8 points.
As nobody is exactly sure how the BSSS scales using the results, it's tough to say why, but the basic understanding is that it comes from the performance of the people in your courses and how they compare with the people in the same courses at other colleges, then additionally scaled based on the performance of the entire college against the other colleges. Being in higher level subjects, specialist maths, chemistry etc. and having high rankings along with other high performing students, I was somewhat protected, only losing .25 from my estimate, but people with the ATAR relying on courses such as literature or core maths, where there is a greater spread of ability, suffered the most, as their rankings were comparatively 'less impressive' due to the lower performance of their classmates in the AST.
 

Numerouno

Regular Member
Hi A1. That's an A class explanation...this algorithm is unknown to me... thanks for that.

My experience: I was taken back when I mentioned gleefully to an overseas admission for Medicine, that I got 99.20 ATAR. They have known that ATAR is not your actual score (just a number for local admissions) and kept asking me what were my actual scores in English, Chemistry, Physics, Biology, and Adv Math etc.. They needed a minimum of 97% marks average (not ATAR), I should have scored 97/100 raw average...phew. They knew too well about this ATAR business and will not consider even a 99.95 unless the average is as mentioned in their selection minimum of 97% HSC with all science subjects (mandatory) to be competitive in line with local applicants. This news was from one of the top universities from a third world country as the competition is very stiff there with students scoring 99+ average ( Bio 199/200, Chem 198/200 Physics 200/200) for Medicine. Luckily in the UK, they considered the ATAR of 98.8 to 99.9 (Oxford) as a minimum but most UCAS (UKCAT Consortium) needed Chem, Bio, English, and High-level Maths or Physics as mandatory for two years (11 & 12) and needed the Science subjects to be included in the ATAR calculation, not Food Tech, Modern History or Business Studies to boost the ATAR number. I had no issues in that front (Phy, Chem, Bio, Adv Eng, Ext 1 Eng, Ext 1 Maths, Ext 2 Maths, French).

I sincerely wanted UMAT to get abolished to something in line with International standards, thanks to UCAT (UKCAT). I am not saying one is worse/ or better than the other. I have seen both in real exam mode. I can not wait for Science subjects to be made mandatory for application to Medicine as a standard in all the Australian Universities to boost the basic science knowledge before commencement or the introduction of Premed which we see in 7-year programs now. I wonder how candidates with Food tech, Modern History, Business Studies, General Maths, and Adv. English who have got admission into Medicine and fared in the Molecular Biology, Genetics subjects in the first year. Recently I came to know that JMP does not even have any pre-requisite in Science, told by an HR manager in a company (known to us) who never studied Science in school or university but took UMAT and got into Medicine UMAT 97%ile ( UON asked the person to complete a bridging scourse in Univeristy - Aboriginal Studies) due to the number of years passed by since graduation. :clap:Hopefully, some rethinking and radical transformation are required for admissions in the future in my opinion.
 

DrDrLMG!

Resident Medical Officer
Administrator
I wonder how candidates with Food tech, Modern History, Business Studies, General Maths, and Adv. English who have got admission into Medicine and fared in the Molecular Biology, Genetics subjects in the first year.

Well, here I am to answer all your questions :D

For clarification's sake, my background.
Pre-tertiary (a very long time ago): predominantly 'arts' subjects. English, Creative Writing, English Lit, and Psychology, etc.
Tertiary: Psychology, Psychology, and more Psychology, a little bit of Sociology, a little bit of Law, and a little bit of Journalism (coz, why not?!). With some more recent Psychology and Epidemiology thrown in during a PGDip.
Employment: Hospital-based allied health.
Extra context: Prior to this year, I'd never heard the term organelle ;)

Currently: First year Medicine, and I am doing really, really (really!) well thanks! Even in molecular biology and genetics subjects! And histology and pharmacology and immunology and microbiology. But also in medical ethics, and population health, and communication skills, and nutrition, and examination skills, and essay writing, and class participation, and giving presentations. And also in time management and stress management and uni/life(/MSO*) balance.

I think, for many people, there is a perception of medicine being a science-only subject, but it is really, really not. For example, UTAS divides the curriculum into four domains. Only ONE of them is strictly 'hard science-based'. The others are incredibly diverse and have nothing to do with whether you know your CD8s from your CD4s.

If you have any other questions about studying medicine with a non-science background, feel free to ask them.

*with the exception of when UMAT results were released, coz, well, #favetimeoftheyear
 
Last edited:

Numerouno

Regular Member
Well, here I am to answer all your questions :D

For clarification's sake, my background.
Pre-tertiary (a very long time ago): predominantly 'arts' subjects. English, Creative Writing, English Lit, and Psychology, etc.
Tertiary: Psychology, Psychology, and more Psychology, a little bit of Sociology, a little bit of Law, and a little bit of Journalism (coz, why not?!). With some more recent Psychology and Epidemiology thrown in during a PGDip.
Employment: Hospital-based allied health.
Extra context: Prior to this year, I'd never heard the term organelle ;)

Currently: First year Medicine, and I am doing really, really (really!) well thanks! Even in molecular biology and genetics subjects! And histology and pharmacology and immunology and microbiology. But also in medical ethics, and population health, and communication skills, and nutrition, and examination skills, and essay writing, and class participation, and giving presentations. And also in time management and stress management and uni/life(/MSO*) balance.

I think, for many people, there is a perception of medicine being a science-only subject, but it is really, really not. For example, UTAS divides the curriculum into four domains. Only ONE of them is strictly 'hard science-based'. The others are incredibly diverse and have nothing to do with whether you know your CD8s from your CD4s.

If you have any other questions about studying medicine with a non-science background, feel free to ask them.

*with the exception of when UMAT results were released, coz, well, #favetimeoftheyear

Great to know you are doing really really well LMG. Hope others also find the same with diverse background. You have changed my perception as I am young and more science focussed. Although Gap year now, I have skipped elementary year promoted from 4 to 6. So in essence I should have finished year 12 only in 2018. Your post will be a morale boost for my Dad who always wanted to do medicine right from his Uni days but family circumstances did not allow that. He went onto finish Bachelor degrees in Chemistry, Production Engineering, Master degree in Industrial Engineering, MBA, Master of Health Management and Master degree in Information Technology, a versatile person with distinction credentials in all the degrees.

He even followed an online course from MIT in "Secret of Life-Biology" which had Molecular Biology in detail, Genetics with Gene mutation and causation for diseases, The famous Codon Table (ATCG), Punnet Squares for Hereditary diseases (I rummaged through his notes)...he used to say that the exam was pretty tough (SBA pattern) and passed. I could even see the students in the MIT class as it was done through online video. I don't remember much as I was in year 6 at that time. He then completed an Aged Care certificate course "Parkinson's and Dementia in Elderly" from Johns Hopkins School of Nursing Online. I will show your post and may be who knows he may pursue Medicine after his retirement and probably become the oldest person to join Medicine in Australia.:)I love Australia...there is no age limit for learning, no prerequisites for medicine and no age limit for retirement. :yay:
 

j95m

Member
Can any tell me more or link me to any information regarding which universities include masters in their calculation for GPA?
 

A1

Rookie Doc
Moderator
Hi

I took the UKCAT exam last year for entry into UK Medical Schools for Sep 2018. I attended the interview after UKCAT and got admitted to a medical school as well. The exam is administered in Sydney ( I am from NSW) at a Pearson Vue centre. Yes, it was a CBT and I got the results as I walked out of the Exam hall i.e I could get a print out of all my section scores. SJT was scored differently from a scale of 1 to 4 (1 being the best and 4 worst as some med schools in the UK will not consider your application if the SJT score is 4). The UKCAT consortium has many med schools from which you can apply to a maximum of only 4 Medical schools in the UCAS application portal. So, the selection of a med school is very important considering the UKCAT score. We have quite many options in Australia, due to the disparity in the selection process based on State/Location / Y12 grading and hence we can apply through all state governing bodies for University entry through UAC/SATAC/VTAC/QTAC/TISC/UTAS etc. As for the UKCAT exam, it strictly adheres to checking your identity in the form of either passport/Licence or other means like School ID, so you can not make any other person sit for you, unlike the Bond system where you or someone else for you can take the psychometric test at home. I found the UKCAT test equally challenging like UMAT although outwardly it looked simpler, due to the shorter durations to complete many questions. The best point was that I could sense I have a chance after receiving the scores within 5 minutes of completing the test...but it also helps to put one out of misery if not done well. there is no waiting. I am a Gap year applicant and improved on my UMAT score (marginally) this time with a chance of getting an interview with JMP/Adelaide/Curtin/Monash and UNSW borderline as my ATAR is not high but 99.20. I noted the UMAT result on the day of boarding the flight but will need to attend the interviews by taking time off :-()

When I attended the UNSW interview last year, I was invited to take the SJT at a CBT room there quoting that the interview selection could be changing in the future and SJT could be part of the selection process. I did not know at that time it would be replacing UMAT altogether. There were many students that day attending the interview, only I and another person opted to take the SJT which was purely voluntary. The ..truth is out now with UMAT changing to UCAT with the introduction of SJT. if I don't get in I will continue with the UK Med school, although expensive but quality education with GMC accreditation and FY1&2 later on. My score is not flashy just 183 (S1 60-S2 60, S3-63). Not sure if I stand a chance in any of the universities mentioned.

Numerouno Thanks for some insight into UKCAT. If you don't mind sharing, what was your 4 section average (out of 900) for UKCAT and your performance on the SJT? I may be applying in the UK and want to know some thresholds. Much appreciated.
 

chinaski

Regular Member
I wonder how candidates with Food tech, Modern History, Business Studies, General Maths, and Adv. English who have got admission into Medicine and fared in the Molecular Biology, Genetics subjects in the first year. Recently I came to know that JMP does not even have any pre-requisite in Science, told by an HR manager in a company (known to us) who never studied Science in school or university but took UMAT and got into Medicine UMAT 97%ile ( UON asked the person to complete a bridging scourse in Univeristy - Aboriginal Studies) due to the number of years passed by since graduation. :clap:Hopefully, some rethinking and radical transformation are required for admissions in the future in my opinion.

You might like to familiarise yourself with how non-science graduates fare in graduate entry medicine with no previous grounding in tertiary-level sciences (which are assumed knowledge of the grad entry syllabi).

Disclosure: I hold both a science and medicine degree (the former having very little, if anything, to do with the subject matter of the latter), and did not complete any science or mathematics subjects in Years 11 or 12.
 

Registered  members with 100+ posts do not see Ads

Numerouno

Regular Member
Numerouno Thanks for some insight into UKCAT. If you don't mind sharing, what was your 4 section average (out of 900) for UKCAT and your performance on the SJT? I may be applying in the UK and want to know some thresholds. Much appreciated.
Hi, good luck with your preparations. My average although not flashy but was Ok to get admission in conjunction with my performance in the interviews. 745/900 average SJT performance band 1. Not sure if I can repeat the SJT at the same level again. I have seen a few people scoring straight 900 (geniuses) doing Medicine at Cambridge and a few scored 900 in QR. I wanted to take the BMAT as well but missed as my final HSC paper (Physics) was on that BMAT exam date in 2017. My preparation to UKCAT was about less than 2 weeks of sporadic check on a few tests as I was engrossed in preparing for HSC and on the side UMAT (Med Entry). UKCAT was the second choice but that's the one came better although I managed a 99.20 ATAR but a dismal UMAT (84%ile). This time I moved it upwards in UMAT...hoping to get interviews (maybe). If it does not click, all is not lost at all, I am at a great university with a fantastic curriculum with a high world ranking for Medicine and which finishes in 5 years with a chance to complete FY1 and FY 2 with full registration from GMC after that. As weeks go by, I am starting to enjoy the course with high calibre cohorts from the UK and around the world. If possible I may come back at a Registrar level if there is a vacancy in hospitals in Australia in the future.:yes:

I may be applying in the UK and want to know some thresholds. Much appreciated.

Please refer to the entry criteria below:

https://www.ukcat.ac.uk/media/1197/using-my-2017-ukcat-result-v2.pdf
 
Last edited by a moderator:

Ian Naga

Retired Lurker
Well, here I am to answer all your questions :D

For clarification's sake, my background.
Pre-tertiary (a very long time ago): predominantly 'arts' subjects. English, Creative Writing, English Lit, and Psychology, etc.
Tertiary: Psychology, Psychology, and more Psychology, a little bit of Sociology, a little bit of Law, and a little bit of Journalism (coz, why not?!). With some more recent Psychology and Epidemiology thrown in during a PGDip.
Employment: Hospital-based allied health.
Extra context: Prior to this year, I'd never heard the term organelle ;)

Currently: First year Medicine, and I am doing really, really (really!) well thanks! Even in molecular biology and genetics subjects! And histology and pharmacology and immunology and microbiology. But also in medical ethics, and population health, and communication skills, and nutrition, and examination skills, and essay writing, and class participation, and giving presentations. And also in time management and stress management and uni/life(/MSO*) balance.

I think, for many people, there is a perception of medicine being a science-only subject, but it is really, really not. For example, UTAS divides the curriculum into four domains. Only ONE of them is strictly 'hard science-based'. The others are incredibly diverse and have nothing to do with whether you know your CD8s from your CD4s.

If you have any other questions about studying medicine with a non-science background, feel free to ask them.

*with the exception of when UMAT results were released, coz, well, #favetimeoftheyear

I am glad you are doing so well. It is fantastic that Australian Universities allow entry into the undergraduate medicine (MBBS/BS-MD) programs without requiring the three science subjects, namely Chemistry/Physics/Biology . However, it looks like almost all Universities need Chemistry at High School for undergraduate medicine. Even UTas. How did you get around the requirement for Chemistry?
 

DrDrLMG!

Resident Medical Officer
Administrator
I am glad you are doing so well. It is fantastic that Australian Universities allow entry into the undergraduate medicine (MBBS/BS-MD) programs without requiring the three science subjects, namely Chemistry/Physics/Biology . However, it looks like almost all Universities need Chemistry at High School for undergraduate medicine. Even UTas. How did you get around the requirement for Chemistry?

I didn’t get around it. I did an 8 week bridging course during summer school. I would otherwise have been ineligible.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Registered  members with 100+ posts do not see Ads

Top