Dentistry as a Mature-Aged Student: Advice Requests

[j2211]

Hi All,
I'm in need of some serious advice. I'm 33 with a family and a job that pays around 110k. I'm becoming increasingly dissatisfied with my job so I'm considering dentistry. Is it worth it for someone at my age? Will there be jobs for grads? Any input will be greatly appreciated.

Thanks
J

 

[Mana]

You'll probably find that dentistry is now starting to be somewhat in oversupply unless you are wanting to live in a rural area.
Also, it'll be a 5 year full time investment and you'll end up with a salary that is much lower than your current one (at least to start with). It's not feasible to be working full time and studying dentistry at the same time, so you'll need to make sure you can support yourself (or your family/partner can support you) while you do that degree.

 

[Ruth]

You'll probably find that dentistry is now starting to be somewhat in oversupply unless you are wanting to live in a rural area.
Also, it'll be a 5 year full time investment and you'll end up with a salary that is much lower than your current one (at least to start with). It's not feasible to be working full time and studying dentistry at the same time, so you'll need to make sure you can support yourself (or your family/partner can support you) while you do that degree.

Much lower? Hmm depends on the job you get. I hear grad jobs in Aus pay pretty well (better than in NZ lol) - like not that much lower than what you are earning now. But yes very big commitment, I had a classmate who worked on weekends and a half day or two as a physio (his previous degree), otherwise his partner was supporting them.

Jobs are certainly becoming harder to get, but if you're happy to move, or to work part-time, then you should be fine. As a 'mature' student you will probably have an upper hand as well since you already know what the job search process entails.

 

[defraggle]

I doubt that your earnings in dent will be < 110k after the first few years, but there are few things to consider:

Dent +ves
- Flexible Part Time Working Arrangements
- Not being project driven - so on the large part work stays at work
- Not wedded to large employment centres - so seachange/greenchange outside large metros all possible
- As a mature aged student, you're probably way more organised, better with patients with the added life experience.

Dent -ves
- Physical toll: back, posture, ergonomics, RSI (so basically look after your body)
- Increased competition: initial job market challenging (so network like crazy)

I was 34 when I quit IT and was earning about 180k/year. I worked out the opportunity cost but came to realise that I was better of in dent in the medium/long term.

Dent was something I always wanted to do, and I was getting burnt out from crazy overtime and very long 18 month projects where in the last 6 months of each project it was 60hr+ weeks and UberEats every night. And having a young family I saw that Dent was more fitting with my stage in life. Unfortunately it was come at an enormous short term opportunity cost of lost income, but luckily my wife has been able to support us. It's not easy though- if you end up having to move interstate for study, the relocation costs and living costs rack up, you lose your friend/family support network, and as a mature aged student you CAN feel a bit left out of the action, particularly if you are committed to family/work so you don't end up engaging as much on the social front. I was working part time in IT until end of 3 year but was really burning the candle at both ends at that stage

 

[ady]

Hi I am a dentist here, from experience I can tell you that you need not worry about your age, we had people in the 40-50 age bracket in our graduating class and several people in there 30s. Most importantly you need to ask yourself 'why' dentistry? Lots of reasons to do it, ideally you need to be driven by the desire to care and help people who need professional care for their oral health. Of course there are people who want to create businesses out of dentistry and nothing wrong with it, just figure out whether you want to be involved with a career that is so hands on, dealing with people's mouths and oral health. Jobs will always be there, your best bet is to start working for the public health as a new grad, that's the best way to break into the workforce, get valuable experience that you may not get privately, build a skillset and then look into the private sector in the meantime if you're keen . Hope that helps!

 

[cheapskate8]

I had a good friend who started at 33. He wasn't the oldest in the course either. Sure it's certainly possible and once youre out pays well. But I would want you to be sure you really want it. 4yrs back at uni with no income is tough and dentistry itself can be stressful even for me who loves it. Will there be jobs? Yeah for sure, but the quality of the job depends on either who you know or how far you're willing to move. I live in regional coastal nsw, earn great money and am very busy. Many in syd would be doing and earning half.
If you want it, it is certainly there for the taking.

 

[Lolita06]

Hi, I would like to hear your opinion about studying dentistry at the age of 52. I am working in finance and I am planning to study dentistry in Australia at the age of 52. When I was 22 I was studying Dentistry for one year back in my country then I got married and moved to Australia with my husband then I had two children and I studied a bachelor of business while I was raising my kids. But now that I am 52 I would like to go back into Dentistry and see if I can apply next year, but I got a lot of thoughts when I think about my age whether to decide to study or not at my age and also I think a lot if what about if I do not find a job when I finish because I will be around 57 or 58 years old. Should I study dentistry, or choose another career if I do not want to continue working in finance.

 

[TKAO]

Hi, I would like to hear your opinion about studying dentistry at the age of 52. I am working in finance and I am planning to study dentistry in Australia at the age of 52. When I was 22 I was studying Dentistry for one year back in my country then I got married and moved to Australia with my husband then I had two children and I studied a bachelor of business while I was raising my kids. But now that I am 52 I would like to go back into Dentistry and see if I can apply next year, but I got a lot of thoughts when I think about my age whether to decide to study or not at my age and also I think a lot if what about if I do not find a job when I finish because I will be around 57 or 58 years old. Should I study dentistry, or choose another career if I do not want to continue working in finance.

I doubt many people on this site are close to your age but I'll give you my two cents:
You age will not be a factor in admissions, you don't need to worry about that. However what I would tell you is that you would need to thoroughly analyse your financial position if you do choose to take that leap. When you are studying dentistry for 5 years, it's very hard to hold down any kind of professional job and when you come out of it, you will only be paid that of a fresh graduate - the same that the 23 year old in your cohort would be paid. One must ask themselves whether they are even in the financial position to do that. You said you have kids, if you have to take care of them still this can be a financial strain.
I don't know the employment mentality for dentists so I'll stay out of that conversation entirely.

 

[ponyswordz]

Hi, I would like to hear your opinion about studying dentistry at the age of 52. I am working in finance and I am planning to study dentistry in Australia at the age of 52. When I was 22 I was studying Dentistry for one year back in my country then I got married and moved to Australia with my husband then I had two children and I studied a bachelor of business while I was raising my kids. But now that I am 52 I would like to go back into Dentistry and see if I can apply next year, but I got a lot of thoughts when I think about my age whether to decide to study or not at my age and also I think a lot if what about if I do not find a job when I finish because I will be around 57 or 58 years old. Should I study dentistry, or choose another career if I do not want to continue working in finance.

Heyoo Lolita, pursuing dentistry at your age and revisiting a career that you have once experienced before is truly a great feeling to have. With every career change however also comes a lot of responsibility, decisions and family commitments especially when age could play a role in your future outlook. Perhaps the 2 most important questions to consider is:

1) Why don't you want to work in finance anymore?
2) Why do you want to work in dentistry?

As you might know from your past dental student experience, dentistry is definitely a physically-demanding career with fine motor skills being quintessential to providing the best PT outcomes. An injury to your eyes, back, neck, shoulder, arms or fingers at your age could have significant implications in ending your career earlier than expected (obviously something we hope to not happen to us). In addition, many PTs you will be working with will have assumed expectations that age = experience/skill and this could be a problem if PTs expect that from you once you graduate.

The necessity of balancing between your family commitments is also an important consideration to take into account. Will you have enough time to look after your kids and provide them with the necessary help that they may need (education, hobbies, etc.)? Are you able to rely on your husband financially or time-wise to take on these duties for the next 5 years (and maybe more)? In dental school, most people will be in their late 10s to early 20s which means that their priorities are often just focused on dental school and partying whereas you may have way more responsibilities to attend to.

Adding on to what TKAO has stated above, dentistry at Griffith university in particular can be very expensive from a financial perspective (3 years of dental science + 2 years master of dentistry -> over $150,000 excluding accommodation) and so paying it off after education will definitely be a big hurdle to get over especially with an early dental graduate salary.

Ultimately, if your heart says that this is a career that you deadset want to go into, I would take the change. However, it definitely comes with a lot of decisions and planning especially for your future outcomes.

 

[Limobean]

Hi MSO, (sorry for the long post) to any mature aged students or anyone that have some advice:

I'm in my mid 20s and was considering trying again to get into dentistry, but I'm in a bit of a dilemma. As I am a female at my age, there are many important life decisions to make in the next 5 years or so (eg. getting married, having children, buying a house, etc) and would like your advice.

Background:
For context, I applied for both Medicine and Dentistry at QLD universities back in high school, but didn't get in as I achieved an OP 2 (ATAR 98.35 specifically).
So I did a Bachelor of Pharmacy at UQ instead. I tried again as a non-standard student for a few years but didn't receive a high enough UMAT for UQ Dent and my GPA just fell short for Griffith Dent. The pharmacy degree was getting subject and content-heavy (6 exams every semester), so I decided to concentrate on my pharmacy degree and let go of dentistry.

I've since graduated with a Bachelor of Pharmacy (Honours) with First Class Honours and successfully completed my intern year.
Fast forward to now and I am now working a stable full-time job as a community pharmacist. I am relatively happy about it (was a lot more negative about pharmacy a few years ago), but think I could do Dent.

I am planning to get married within the next few years and buy a house with my partner who is also a pharmacist.

What I'm thinking:
I am thinking of sitting the UCAT in 2021 to gain entry into UQ Dent in 2022 as a non-standard student.
I know dentistry will be full-on for 5 years so if I go down this path, I can't imagine having/raising children during the degree.
There are many things I need to factor in, regardless of which decision I end up going with.

Questions:
1. Mums out there, would you recommend having children earlier (eg. late 20s), as opposed to later (eg. early 30s)?
2. Would you be allowed to do certain placements/procedures when you're pregnant?
3. Would universities accept GPA from 10+ years ago? Do you need to do recent tertiary study if you decide to apply in your 30s?


Options:
Option 1 - Continue working as a pharmacist, get married and have children first, wait until they're a bit older, then try getting into dentistry in my early 30s?
Option 2 - Try getting into dentistry in 2022, work part-time as a pharmacist while studying, graduate in my early 30s and have children after that? I know fertility drops dramatically after that age and I will still need to stabilise my new career in dentistry.
Option 3 - (Argh!) I try getting into dentistry in 2022, have children while at uni and juggle that with uni, work, etc, then graduate in my early 30s. :0
Option 4 - Continue with pharmacy and let go of dentistry altogether.
Option 5 - Other?

There are positives and negatives to every option, I just don't know what to do yet and appreciate any advice.

Cheers.

 

[A1]

my GPA just fell short for Griffith Dent.

QTAC applications close in a week so I want to bring this up quickly. According to this conversion table
> Higher education study

1st class Hons is given GPA 7 / Rank 99.95, which would give you a Griffith place next year. However it isn't clear whether this applies only to a stand-alone Honours degree (since it's listed under Postgraduate) or including Honours for the full undergrad degree. QTAC costs ~$70, I would submit an application to meet the deadline before deciding doing Dent or not.

Btw I haven't seen the 10-year rule stated by any undergrad med/dent school.

 

[Limobean]

According to this conversion table
> Higher education study

As this is from a QUT website, does this sort of calculation apply to other universities too?
Also, my pharmacy degree isn't a postgraduate degree?

I didn't even consider I could get into Griffith because I thought I didn't have a good enough cumulative GPA (GPA 6.3). The high fees for the postgraduate component deterred me from that as well.

Also, you are right in terms of submitting an application quickly for Griffith Dent, as 2022 entry would be based on UMAT, interview and academic achievement and no longer just academic achievement.

 

[Crow]

However it isn't clear whether this applies only to a stand-alone Honours degree (since it's listed under Postgraduate) or including Honours for the full undergrad degree.

If it’s anything like GEMSAS, the stand-alone honours gets given a 7 in its own year whereas an embedded honours will be viewed simply as part of the rest of the degree, in which case the GPA of the entire degree will be used. We don’t have any data to say whether this is the case though, so best to consult with Griffith directly.

 

[A1]

As this is from a QUT website, does this sort of calculation apply to other universities too?

Although from QUT it seems to match well with Griffith's conversions we have seen, for example GPA 6.875 converts to 99.80 for Griffith Dent.

If it’s anything like GEMSAS, the stand-alone honours gets given a 7 in its own year whereas an embedded honours will be viewed simply as part of the rest of the degree, in which case the GPA of the entire degree will be used.

Yes that was my concern. However there's a table for Postgraduate degrees which include an Honours column, whereas the table for Degree study 1+ FTE has a footnote "(this table) refers to study at the level of bachelors degree (awarded without honours)". So bachelor degree awarded with Honours falls into no-man land.

 

[Crow]

Yes that was my concern. However there's a table for Postgraduate degrees which include an Honours column, whereas the table for Degree study 1+ FTE has a footnote "(this table) refers to study at the level of bachelors degree (awarded without honours)". So bachelor degree awarded with Honours falls into no-man land.

Yeah, it’s listed as an AQF level 8 (so honours level) degree on the UQ site which should then mean it’s treated like a standalone honours for GPA calculation purposes, but who knows what the official protocol is.

 

[Limobean]

QTAC costs ~$70, I would submit an application to meet the deadline before deciding doing Dent or not.

Thanks A1, I've submitted my application through QTAC. I might contact Griffith to clarify the Honours part.

 

[rshaya]

Hello! I know this is the wrong thread to post in however I can't seem to get into contact with anyone.

I am a third-year health science student at Latrobe wanting to get into dent anywhere that'll take me. I am completing my UCAT this August and wanted to know if internal transfer is still possible (for LTU Bendigo) and how aspire works. I didn't do well in year 12 however am sitting at a 90 WAM and hope to get this higher by the end of the year. Could someone help me out with other universities I could get into with the UCAT and requirements needed. I am majoring in anatomy and physiology. Many thanks!

 

[Unluckydude]

Hello! I know this is the wrong thread to post in however I can't seem to get into contact with anyone.

I am a third-year health science student at Latrobe wanting to get into dent anywhere that'll take me. I am completing my UCAT this August and wanted to know if internal transfer is still possible (for LTU Bendigo) and how aspire works. I didn't do well in year 12 however am sitting at a 90 WAM and hope to get this higher by the end of the year. Could someone help me out with other universities I could get into with the UCAT and requirements needed. I am majoring in anatomy and physiology. Many thanks!

There are several threads dedicated to Latrobe dentistry:

LaTrobe - La Trobe Dentistry: General Discussion

Hi does anyone know what this year atar cut off was Thanks

medstudentsonline.com.au

LaTrobe - La Trobe Dentistry: Internal Transfer Pathway

Hello Guys! I have a question directed to students who are considering to study dentistry at Latrobe University's Bachelor of Health Sciences in Dentistry/ Master of Dentistry program. I am planning to take the Bachelor of Health Sciences at Latrobe Uni located at the Bundoora campus to gain...

medstudentsonline.com.au

As someone mentioned in the threads, internal transfer at LTU is becoming incredibly competitive. A person had a WAM of 92 and got rejected last year.

Only yr12 students are eligible for the aspire program. I don't think you can apply for it.

UPDATED Dentistry Schools Selection Criteria Y12s & Non-standards

UPDATED (June, 2020). Dentistry Entry pathways table created by Dreamer and Cal. Thank you to both of them for their hard work and dedication to the cause! From LMG! ** note: prices quoted are for 2020 entry and are typically indexed to increase slightly each year. While these prices are a...

medstudentsonline.com.au

This thread lists the requirements for all dental schools. Do you have any specific questions?

you'll end up with a salary that is much lower than your current one (at least to start with)

Public dentists in Queensland have a starting salary close to 110K and public dentists in Tasmania have a starting salary slightly higher than 110K. If you work in a rural area, you also get an allowance can be up to 30% of your base salary. Furthermore, dentists in the private sector usually get paid more. How can you be so sure that j2211 will end-up with salary "much lower than"110K unless the OP wants to become a public dentist in Victoria or NSW? I think Victorian dental graduates working in the public sector get less than 80k a year, but they are probably the worst paid dentists in the country.

Wage Rates – Dental Stream

Queensland Health Wage Rates for the Dental Stream.

www.health.qld.gov.au

Employee benefits

Find out the benefits of working for the Department of Health (Tasmania). This includes leave, salary packages, training and work/life balance initiatives.

www.dhhs.tas.gov.au

https://www.health.qld.gov.au/__data/assets/pdf_file/0025/441097/rural-remote-incentive.pdf

 

[chinaski]

How can you be so sure that j2211 will end-up with salary "much lower than"110K unless the OP wants to become a public dentist in Victoria or NSW?

Given that Victoria and NSW make up about 60% of the population of Australia, one might reasonably assume there's at least a fair chance that the OP might end up there.

 

[Unluckydude]

Given that Victoria and NSW make up about 60% of the population of Australia, one might reasonably assume there's at least a fair chance that the OP might end up there.

According to the Dental Board of Australia, around 55% of dentists are registered in Victoria or NSW. Furthermore, Australian Institute of Health and Welfare reported that the ratio of public dentists vs private dentist in NSW and Victoria is around 1:10. Unlike medicine, new dental graduates are not required to work in the public sector and most of them do not work in the public sector. Therefore, it can be estimated that there is a 5% chance that the OP might become a public dentist in Victoria and NSW. More importantly, what Mana said was "you'll end up with a salary that is much lower than your current one (at least to start with)". I agree that there is a chance that the OP might have a starting salary much lower than 110K. But the chance isn't high and Mana's statement grossly overestimated the possibility that the OP will have a starting salary much lower than 110K.

That being said, I'm not in anyway suggesting that becoming a dentist can make you rich or anything. It's not really a high salary if you take the asset bubble into consideration and it plateaus fairly quickly.