Quick Questions Thread: 2018

[DrDrLMG!]

sorry i'm late to the party.
My recommendation to your son is to do the 3 year program and go into med if that is his end goal. I say this with the following in mind:
- financially: if he wants to do med anyway then the income loss of 2 years of med vastly outweighs any benifit he gets from getting his pharmacy license. (in general locum pharmacists don't make as much money as they used to so the justification of having a high paying job while studying doesn't end up paying off in the long run)
- accreditation: I would find it very hard to beleive there is some one that is currently holding on to a pharmacist and medical registration with AHPRA at the same time (i'm not even sure youre allowed to do that) and so the extra 2 years (1 study + 1 intern) will have been only worthwhile for 4 years.

I could probably think of a few other reasons but my overall recommendation is to sit down and think is med for me. if it is then take the easiest path to it and I would not think of those three years as a waste because they must be done anyway (most MD programs are 6-7 years) and he is doing it in a course that will help him in the med course.

If you have any questions get in contact with me and I'll try to help, I just go MIA a lot haha

While I agree that if this person gets a Prov Med offer and definitely wants to do Med then finishing BPharm is probably pointless, if the intention isn’t to finish BPharm in the first place, then I don’t really see the point of enrolling in it at all. Choosing something like BNurs instead would mean a possible job to support the student through Med. Whereas a BPharmSci is kind of a nothing degree (employment-wise). Best they could hope for would be Dispense Tech probably (and I know from experience there’s not much flexibility and the pay isn’t great), not to mention BPharmSci isn’t even necessary for Dispense Tech jobs.

If employment isn’t an issue, then I’d say do whatever 3 year degree interests the OP most. Science, humanities, whatever... just make sure pre-reqs are met. A BPharmSci is going to be no more useful than most things, one way or another, and could be less useful than some.

Re. dual AHPRA rego. I’m sure it’s infrequent, but as long as you meet both lots of PD requirements and pay both lots of rego fees, then I can’t see AHPRA refusing the $$, tbh! The professional Boards are separate. Not that I’m necessarily suggesting this person aim for that, just saying I can’t see AHPRA having an issue with it.

 

[A1]

- accreditation: I would find it very hard to beleive there is some one that is currently holding on to a pharmacist and medical registration with AHPRA at the same time (i'm not even sure youre allowed to do that) and so the extra 2 years (1 study + 1 intern) will have been only worthwhile for 4 years.

I don't think the intent is for dual registration. I remember the parent wrote in an earlier post Pharmacy is to fall back on in case Med doesn't work out one or two years into the MD course, something like that.

In that case my suggestion is to ask UQ first - if he decides to graduate with the 3-year PharmSci degree (to move into MD) then MD doesn't work out, can he come back to 4th year Pharm to get the degree? Would be good if he can.

If not allowed so then do the full 4 years for BPharm, move into MD, if MD doesn't work out fall back to Pharm career. The Pharm "internship" doesn't have to follow immediately after graduation, it can even be done on part-time/casual basis until completing 1800 logbook hours.

 

[Woo18]

Thank you A1, LMG and Ali-as for all your responses and thoughts we are so grateful forbthis wonderful page. Just to clarify no he doesn't want to be accredited for both. His end goal is medicine however he is trying to make sure he does a degree that will allow him a good job if medicine doesnt't work out for him. He is also trying to find a degree/profession that he would enjoy if he wasn't successful at getting an offer for medicine. We are going to try to make an appointment to talk to someone at UQ when we travel down to sit the UMAT to help him make some decisions. As they say knowledge is power so we are going to try to go into these decisions with our eyes open. Thanks again so much.

 

[Kezia]

Hi Guys! I’d really appreciate it if someone can enlighten me with my postgrad med dilemma.

I commenced biomed this year as every uni told me that’s the best option if I dont get into med. However, I found the lab (research) side of it veryyyyy boring and I am very sure that I would not enjoy working in research if I dont ever get into medicine. I’m transferring into Nursing this semester 2, as it has always been my original plan since the beginning if I dont get into undergrad med until people told me about biomed. When I apply for postgrad medicine, would they look at my one semester results of biomed along with my nursing results? Or would they just look at the last 3 years of my nursing degree (as I’ve read on GEMSAS website)? Would that ‘3-year rule’ still apply to me even though I would graduate mid year?

Just getting anxious about switching mid year, as I’m afraid it would mess up my chances for post grad but I don’t really want to waste time in Biomed

 

[Crow]

Hi Guys! I’d really appreciate it if someone can enlighten me with my postgrad med dilemma.

I commenced biomed this year as every uni told me that’s the best option if I dont get into med. However, I found the lab (research) side of it veryyyyy boring and I am very sure that I would not enjoy working in research if I dont ever get into medicine. I’m transferring into Nursing this semester 2, as it has always been my original plan since the beginning if I dont get into undergrad med until people told me about biomed. When I apply for postgrad medicine, would they look at my one semester results of biomed along with my nursing results? Or would they just look at the last 3 years of my nursing degree (as I’ve read on GEMSAS website)? Would that ‘3-year rule’ still apply to me even though I would graduate mid year?

Just getting anxious about switching mid year, as I’m afraid it would mess up my chances for post grad but I don’t really want to waste time in Biomed

3 Full time equivalent (8 subjects = 1 FTE year) years are used for GEMSAS GPA calculations, so your biomed degree results wouldn’t count, as nursing is a 3 year degree.

 

[Kezia]

3 Full time equivalent (8 subjects = 1 FTE year) years are used for GEMSAS GPA calculations, so your biomed degree results wouldn’t count, as nursing is a 3 year degree.

Because I'm switching from UQ (current uni) to USQ to do nursing mid year, people have been telling me that I'd be better off switching back to UQ next year as I would have better chances at getting into grad med there and if I dont get into med, I'd have a better chance of getting a nursing job if I graduate at a Go8 uni. Is this true? Switching university would prolong my undergrad by another 6 months and would also cost more HECS fees. So I'm really worried about these issues. My pre-med friends suggested that I would probably be better off just not going to uni at all this upcoming semester and apply for UQ next year but I'm not really keen on wasting time. I was thinking that if I stay at USQ and graduate mid-year, I'd be able to focus on GAMSAT solely for a couple of months before the September exam and also enter workforce 6 months earlier than if I switch back to UQ just to graduate from a 'prestigious' university. Also, USQ is only 10 mins drive from my house while UQ is 1-2 hrs travel time so that's a big factor as well. Is this a better plan or am I shooting myself on the foot again like I did when I chose biomed

 

[DrDrLMG!]

Because I'm switching from UQ (current uni) to USQ to do nursing mid year, people have been telling me that I'd be better off switching back to UQ next year as I would have better chances at getting into grad med there and if I dont get into med, I'd have a better chance of getting a nursing job if I graduate at a Go8 uni. Is this true? Switching university would prolong my undergrad by another 6 months and would also cost more HECS fees. So I'm really worried about these issues. My pre-med friends suggested that I would probably be better off just not going to uni at all this upcoming semester and apply for UQ next year but I'm not really keen on wasting time. I was thinking that if I stay at USQ and graduate mid-year, I'd be able to focus on GAMSAT solely for a couple of months before the September exam and also enter workforce 6 months earlier than if I switch back to UQ just to graduate from a 'prestigious' university. Also, USQ is only 10 mins drive from my house while UQ is 1-2 hrs travel time so that's a big factor as well. Is this a better plan or am I shooting myself on the foot again like I did when I chose biomed

I know that for Medicine the Uni you graduate from is not an issue. I’d imagine it’s the same for Nursing but I don’t actually know for sure, and there may be some inherent biases that people ‘in the trade’ might be more aware of. Hopefully someone else can weigh in...

 

[A1]

people have been telling me that I'd be better off switching back to UQ next year as I would have better chances at getting into grad med there

Currently that does not give any better chance for UQ grad med since after achieving GPA 5 (at UQ or any uni) it all depends on your Gamsat score. In 1-2 years time there will be an MMI interview but I highly doubt the interview process would specifically favour UQ students.

 

[Kezia]

Currently that does not give any better chance for UQ grad med since after achieving GPA 5 (at UQ or any uni) it all depends on your Gamsat score. In 1-2 years time there will be an MMI interview but I highly doubt the interview process would specifically favour UQ students.

I thought so too. Because I would assume that they would rather you have a high GPA and a competitive GAMSAT score than you graduating from a Go8 school with an average GPA.

 

[Kezia]

Currently that does not give any better chance for UQ grad med since after achieving GPA 5 (at UQ or any uni) it all depends on your Gamsat score. In 1-2 years time there will be an MMI interview but I highly doubt the interview process would specifically favour UQ students.

The uni I’m moving into for mid-year requires doing summer semesters to finish the degree in 3 years. If I did summer semesters, would I still be doing 1FTE and be eligible for grad med? I’m worried because there are some normal semesters where I would only be doing 3 courses. Is the last 3 years of your degree for GEMSAS defined as from Sem 1-Sem2/3 or is it start of 2018 to end of 2018?

 

[A1]

I’m worried because there are some normal semesters where I would only be doing 3 courses. Is the last 3 years of your degree for GEMSAS defined as from Sem 1-Sem2/3 or is it start of 2018 to end of 2018?

FTE doesn't go by calendar year but by the number of units that constitute a full-time year. The USQ Nursing course is shown as 3 FT years 24 units, so FTE-1 is the first 8 units, FTE-2 second 8 units... regardless which semester you do them in.

 

[DrDrLMG!]

FTE doesn't go by calendar year but by the number of units that constitute a full-time year. The USQ Nursing course is shown as 3 FT years 24 units, so FTE-1 is the first 8 units, FTE-2 second 8 units... regardless which semester you do them in.

Hey, A1 random question for general interest. UTAS offer a fast-track nursing degree (as I'm sure other unis do, too) that can be done over two years. But as it involves full time spring school and ends up being 24 (actually 25) units, does this satisfy GEMSAS? I'd think it does given your explanation above, but just checking if it's a possible 'faster' route to grad med for people.

ETA: Actually, on reflection, I think the course completion date of late Feb (end of Spring School), with results not released until March would mean it wouldn't work... hmmm.

 

[A1]

ETA: Actually, on reflection, I think the course completion date of late Feb (end of Spring School), with results not released until March would mean it wouldn't work... hmmm.

You can check in the 80-page long Gemsas Guide, from memory 3 or 4 of the Gemsas schools accept 2-year accelerated degrees. However the catch is, normal degree you apply in final/3rd year, accelerated you can only apply *after* having completed it. So equivalent to 3rd year, they don't like letting you gain a year in time.

 

[Kezia]

You can check in the 80-page long Gemsas Guide, from memory 3 or 4 of the Gemsas schools accept 2-year accelerated degrees. However the catch is, normal degree you apply in final/3rd year, accelerated you can only apply *after* having completed it. So equivalent to 3rd year, they don't like letting you gain a year in time.

Does this mean that there would be no point overloading to finish a 3-year degree faster? Because you won't finish your last sem (summer sem) until about February and it would be too late to apply for the same year.

 

[Mana]

Does this mean that there would be no point overloading to finish a 3-year degree faster? Because you won't finish your last sem (summer sem) until about February and it would be too late to apply for the same year.

That depends on the point of your degree, which hopefully has merits of its own rather than just being a degree you are doing to try to get into medicine after. If your degree gives you an obvious pathway into the workforce, then finishing your degree earlier means that you could enter the workforce earlier and get paid, or you could take some time off to go and do other things, like travel or volunteer.

 

[A1]

Does this mean that there would be no point overloading to finish a 3-year degree faster? Because you won't finish your last sem (summer sem) until about February and it would be too late to apply for the same year.

The mentioned rule applies to 2-year accelerated degrees as run by the uni, not quite the same as self overloading to finish a little earlier. In your case I understand you will try to complete 24 units in 2.5 calendar years (to make up for the 0.5 year you already spent at UQ). If you can overload + summer courses by 4 units by mid 3rd year, you should have the normal 4-unit load left for the final Aug-Nov semester. This should be fine for Gemsas.

Otoh if you will need to use the Dec-Feb semester beyond to complete I'm not sure whether Gemsas would accept your application at mid 3rd year. I'm inclined to think they would not.

 

[Majd]

Yes, but you should do a degree on its own merits, rather than for the sake of getting into medicine or dentistry, because the vast majority of people who attempt to do this will not get in.

what is your thoughts about doing pharmacy as a degree with goal to change into medicine or dentistry? what are the pros and cons? thanks

 

[Mana]

what is your thoughts about doing pharmacy as a degree with goal to change into medicine or dentistry? what are the pros and cons? thanks

I think you have missed the point of exactly what I just said (in the thread I just responded to this initial question in) - if you are doing any degree, you should be doing it for its own merits, (not "with goal to change to medicine or dentistry" - choose something you'd be happy with in the very likely scenario that you never get into either medicine or dentistry and while you're doing that, sure, put applications into medicine and dentistry in the meantime) given that it's possible to get into medicine or dentistry after any degree. No, being a pharmacist is not like being a dentist or doctor and being a pharmacist does not increase your chances of getting into medicine or dentistry any more than any other degree does.

At this point, you've asked a whole lot of questions which are already answered on the forum if you do a quick forum search (the search bar is in the top right hand corner), including an entire subforum dedicated to pharmacy (Pharmacy), for which you can read other students experiences and questions already dedicated to this.

 

[Majd]

If USyd will graduate you with a BSc degree at end of 3rd year then yes you can sit GAMSAT in 2nd year, apply in 3rd year and start med the year after without going on to complete the BEng.

But if USyd will only graduate you with the two degrees together after 4-5 years then technically you are not supposed to sit GAMSAT in 2nd year. I don't know if ACER would kick up a fuss about it though.

(Btw take more care with using the word brethen as MSO isn't all male)

Shalom, MSO brethren.

I have a quick question, and what better place to post it than the ‘Quick questions’ thread.

Is it possible to sit the GAMSAT, in the ‘penultimate’ year of one degree, in a dual degree?

Say for instance, some incredibly naive med hopeful were to enrol in USyd’s BEng/BSc program, and did only credits for the BSc in their 1st year, and the 1st semester of the 2nd year; would they able to sit the GAMSAT, in March of their 2nd year?

That year is technically their ‘second last year’, so would that score be counted?

Hi, what do you guys think about doing bachelor of pharmacy with long term goal to change into med or dent? do you have any tips on this way? thanks

 

[Mana]

Hi, what do you guys think about doing bachelor of pharmacy with long term goal to change into med or dent? do you have any tips on this way? thanks

Neither of the people you have quoted have any experience studying or applying for pharmacy.